Fate/stay night: Unlimited Blade Works TV 2

Discussion in 'Specific Anime Discussion' started by Naga, Apr 1, 2015.

  1. RickNoel

    RickNoel Member

    You're correct, I misinterpreted which scene you meant. My mistake.
    In that case, yes, I do find that part of the scene even more disturbing than the prior part, and that scene as a whole far more disturbing than Kirei's earlier equivalent.
  2. ZetsubouKaiji

    ZetsubouKaiji Forum Moderator Database Moderator

    Episode 8:

    This was probably the best episode in a looong while. It wasn't perfect and suffered from most of the issues I've had with the series, but I think it was at least trying to accomplish some development even if it wasn't particularly successful.

    Let's start with what I found good. I thought Lancer's scenes finally showed what it meant to be a noble spirit and a servant. He manages to kill Kirei and scare off Shinji before dying himself.

    Watching how far he'd go to protect Rin I found myself imagining a series that focused on the two of them. Lancer being cocky and opening flirting with her have been some of the better parts of the series. It's shame everything has to focus on Shiro because I imagine Rin and Lancer making for more interesting protagonists.

    Yeah, it does suck that Kirei reveals himself only to get immediately killed off and I hated this rape-y bit:


    This does blunt a bit of my admiration for these scenes but I've kind of come to accept that he just isn't the same character he was in Zero. He's no longer the fleshed out villain he was, but just a normal bland antagonist.

    Still it does give Lancer a moment to shine and as the most likable character I thought he acquitted himself well in the end. I think he's the ideal of what a Noble Spirit should be while at the same time showing the tragedy of being a servant. They don't get to pick their masters which means they can get their values ground into the dirt and there's very little they can do about it. Lancer fought it as best he could until the very end and his noble soul won out at a great cost.

    Now we get to the more problematic bit Shiro and Archer. I appreciate that they at least tried to have Shiro introspect this episode. The episode does have him think about values and what they really mean. The problem I have here is Shiro hasn't been built up enough as a character and it makes a lot of what happens here meaningless due to a lack of context. I think where the anime has failed is to flesh out Shiro.

    Instead the anime pretty much sucks off Archer to trying to make him look like the coolest guy with this great regret and tragic backstory. Unfortunately his grudge is too shallow for me to really see Archer as being all that cool. After hearing him out the last couple of episode he sounds like an immature dick that lacks the ability to change even when he knows he's being naive.

    The imbalance between Archer and Shiro is another reason these scenes fail. Shiro is a hollow character with the most shounen of motives and compared to Archer he's got zero weight. Regardless of what I think of Archer, what he is has been fleshed out these last couple of episodes. When Shiro and Archer clash Archer should win easily both in ideology and actual fighting which means the episode has to pull something out of its ass for Shiro to actually win and hard asspull it does.

    This episode is dragged down by the general failings of the series, but on its own it is one of the better episodes. There were at least a few good scenes and some attempts at development. Shame those attempts at development come too little too late and in the end has to resort to some asspull.
  3. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Episode 8:

    Ok, so this episode was pretty good when it came to the action scenes. Actually, it was REALLY good when it came to animating the fights. And I liked how Lancer went out like a boss, how Kirei died, and how Shinji ran away (lol). But everything else....ugh....

    I used to think that Kirito from Sword Art Online was the most shallow main character in anime. I WAS WRONG! Shirou takes the cake and eats it too; his ideals make no sense whatsoever. He's got this goal of being a hero of justice, and is committed to it. But then his future self comes along and shows him that his dream will accomplish jack s*** and leave him as a miserable person. Any other person with half a brain would probably change his plans. But what does Shirou do after hearing this? He decides to pursue his hopeless dream anyways. WTF?! I may add some other stuff later, but I can't think right now; that episode just annoyed me too much.
  4. Taek

    Taek Well-Known Member

    Posted by Taek on May 25, 2015
    Episode 20

    I really don't want to talk about this too much
    Lancer going out the way he did was awesome, though I would have preferred him to kill Shinji too. Kirei is a pastiche of what he was before, we've known that for a while, it made the weird rapey scene even worse for me as it's not something F/Z Kirei would ever have done.

    The fight between Archer and Shirou was dull. I remarked in the first season about how good the fight choreography was when Saber, Lancer, Assassin and Archer fought in melee battles, sword blows seemed to have weight, power transfer through body movement was taken in to account and it made them look good, even when being exaggerated. Not the same this time around, useless sword swings and shitty blocks, none of the above taken into account, and it just made for a very shounen-esque "how can we make this look cool" fight.

    The conversation between the two was really badly scripted, "Just because you're correct doesn't mean you're right", I get what he's saying, but what a really shit line. "That way lies Hell!" again and again and again. And we have another week of the two of them going at it, great.
  5. RickNoel

    RickNoel Member

    Ep 8

    It's all being dragged out too much. The scene in the VN took probably not even 30 minutes to get through, yet here they go spending ~three episodes on the same thing. Also a little awkward and embarrassing that for one of the highlight fights of the series, the choreography has tanked so considerably. They swing, they stand there, they talk for a loooong time. Rinse, repeat.

    On the flip side, though, I like the plethora of F/Z references. Since the prequel series was written long after the VN, the original VN didn't really have much about Kiritsugu, the Fourth Grail War, or the fire. They were events that happened, but all in the past and truly not all that relevant. So, the new references to F/Z are nice, even if some of the scenes (again) dragged on for too long and were a tad too repetitive.

    I'm glad they threw Avalon back in there to explain Shirou's healing abilities. The VN mostly forgot Avalon existed for this route (though it's real big in the Fate route) and instead just had Shirou "swordify" to heal everything. I guess it was kind of cool that Shirou's oh-so-OP heal was also killing him at the same time, but it really wasn't explained that well in the first place. Worth noting that his swordification is also the origin of the lines from his and Archer's chant that are variations of, "My body is made of swords."

    All in all pretty fun, but nothing spectacular, and actually somewhat of a disappointment compared to what we were led to believe we'd be seeing in this episode. I love the Ufotable adaptation, but everything is still a constant reminder that the writing in the VN wasn't exactly stellar.

    Weekly reminder that this Kirei is the original Kirei. Urobuchi remade, modified and enhanced his character with F/Z, but this Kirei is still the "real" Kirei. Not that that makes him in any way better, but it's still important to note that this series is staying true to the VN, while F/Z's Kirei was an original creation.

    Heaven's Feel Kirei is still the best of the three routes, so I'm looking forward to that in the movie(s).
  6. Taek

    Taek Well-Known Member

    Posted by Taek on May 25, 2015
    I'm aware of that, he's still a shadow of what he was in Zero.
  7. ZetsubouKaiji

    ZetsubouKaiji Forum Moderator Database Moderator

    Episode 9:

    This episode left absolutely no impression on me whatsoever. I watched just a few hours ago and I don't remember anything that happened other than Shinji doing an Akira impression. The fight between Shiro and Archer left zero impact. The usually good animation was wasted on the two of them flailing around until Shiro gets shounen power up to win the fight. Also, the adsurd size of the projected swords made it almost funny in how stupid it looked.

    Then there's Gilgamesh. He could have ended things right there if he'd killed Shiro too. He had no reason to keep him alive and Shiro was on his last leg. Instead Gilgs leaves for some poorly explained reason after killing Archer and then explaining his plan like some Saturday morning cartoon villain.

    Rin on the other hand does absolutely nothing this episode. After being saved by Lancer last episode she stumbles upon the end of the battle between Shiro and Archer only to scream out as Archer is killed. It's also like she's completely forgotten that she's Saber's master.

    We get a completely out of place Saber flashback during the fight which has nothing to do with anything that was going on. There was no point to even having her here during the fight because she has no part to take in it. Then she just stands there while Gilgamesh announces his plans with a shocked look on her face.

    The big problem with this episode is that it is called answer and yet no answer is really given or at least not one that has any meaning. Shiro is completely underdeveloped as a character. The series has all but ignored him for most of its run and now that his big moment has come the time is taken up with Archer flashbacks, Saber flashbacks, Gilgamesh flashback and even a stupid CG Grail Flashback. Archer does get some character development, but it is poorly done and as I've said before just makes him look petulant.

    Overall, this simple story didn't need this many episodes. The dry speeches are dull and repetitive. The main character doesn't get any development and is instead just given some typical shounen powerups when he needs them. I think the Deen movie was better. While it was by no means great it did cut out a ton of useless bullshit and told the same basic story in a more compact manner. Even the argument about animation quality doesn't hold much water with the overuse of shitty CG being used in this adaptation. I'm also think the fights were shit in the Deen version because the fights in the VN are shit. Ufotoable might have more budget but even they can't make this crap look good or even entertaining.

    The episode was boring and forgettable as most of this series has been.
  8. Taek

    Taek Well-Known Member

    Posted by Taek on May 31, 2015
    Episode 21



    Absolutely fucking hilarious, "look how grimdark we are as we indulge in the body horror of a 16 year old boy, this is spr srs". It's probably the only memorable thing that happened too, because the fight resolution was shit, the grail exposition was shit, Gilg's little "HURRRRRR I KILL EVRYWAN" speech was shit.

    Rin did nothing this week, and we get to see how she share mana with Shirou next week, hence a super important debate across all of the internet about the 2 of them fucking, yeah this is so awesomely written guyz.

    Saber, what even are you anymore? I don't fucking know, not only are you different to Zero, you're different to the first season of this dreck.

    Worst episode in a long time, this arc has taken far too long to resolve itself, and in the end, naught has changed Shirou in any single way.
  9. ZetsubouKaiji

    ZetsubouKaiji Forum Moderator Database Moderator

    I read that the last episode is going to be another fucking double length episode and I can't think of any reason why because there really isn't enough story left to fill up three regular length episodes much less two regular episodes and a double. It almost certainly means the ending is going to be drawn out and we'll get even more shitty CG.

    Tae's right the fight between
    Shiro and Archer got drawn out for three episodes with the majority of that being flashback. Some of them were necessary, but for the most part they served as lazy filler for more exposition or served no purpose at all. I mean Saber's flashback this episode was one of the most pointless things I've seen in an anime that wasn't a comedy or a parody of some sort.

    Annd what is Gil's motivation again? I guess he's just a dick for the sake of it. I mean Gil in Zero was an asshole, but at least I understood his motivation for being a dickweed and even found it compelling to watch. Now he's a Bond villain announcing his plans instead of killing obstacles in his way.
  10. LinkSword


    20 -

    They could have just written ''I'll keep on being a fucking idiot'' right there at the end of the script and not only would it have sounded the same than the actual line, it'd at least be sincere. Awful waste of time this whole 80-percent inner monologuing / 20-percent sword clashing has been.

    On the other hand I at least enjoyed Lancer in the first half, though. He was far better in this version of the story than he was in the route Deen adapted.

    On the other-other hand
    FSN Kirei is a laughable disappointment after all. Guess that Heaven's Feel movie will be the last chance for decent closure to his arc, but naturally by this point my expectations are close to null.

    And I'm still pissed that Shinji hasn't died. Is that fuckwit seriously going to survive all of this? Come on...

    This has probably been mentioned in earlier comments as well, but the animation for the battle that's meant to be a climax for the series' themes wasn't even that good by ufotable standards. Lancer vs Archer some episodes ago definitely looked crispier, smoother and more detailed.
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2015
  11. ZetsubouKaiji

    ZetsubouKaiji Forum Moderator Database Moderator

    Episode 10:

    Ugggggggggh, Rin is fucking horrible. Shiro being horrible is kind of a given at this point, but he was just his usual oblivious self this episode, but Rin's tsundere act was unfuckingbearable to watch. I had to pause the episode several times and grind my teeth to get through it. Even if I cared about what they were doing Rin's generic tsun lines getting played as comedy would have ruined the episode for me anyway. Rin has really gotten no character development in either season and while her characterization might have been strong in the very first episode of season one, she's just been the a bare bones tsundere since then.

    I would talk about this episode, but frankly there is nothing to talk about. It was twenty of minutes of boring exposition. I suppose this is where Rin and Shiro would have had sex in the VN, but at least the adaptation spared us of that image. However, what we got wasn't much better with Rin transferring her magical fish into Shiro's body so he can make marbles...

    And has this series ever explained what a reality marble is? I vaguely get the concept, but the magic system here is really poorly explained. I've only got the sketchiest knowledge of the terminology and I feel like I sort of have to fill in a lot of the gaps on my own or go look shit up and the moment I have to look something up to understand important story elements then the series has failed as an adaptation in my eyes. An adaptation should stand on its own without expecting me to do homework.

    Oh and Saber is there and I have no idea why. She is hilariously out of place in, well in the entire second season. She's got no place in the story and it's pretty obvious they are just adding scenes with her that don't fit trying to give them thematic resonance with Shiro and failing really hard at it. Of course the problem is Shiro's development has no meat and brief flashbacks of Saber's past don't help to flesh anything out so her conversation with him is mostly meaningless. Also anyone watching this without knowing about Stay/Night is likely going to be confused as fuck about her flashbacks.

    I mean so in the VN does she just go sit in the dojo while Rin and Shiro are fucking? I mean she knows what they are doing because Rin went and discussed it with her. I did laugh thinking Rin went to ask permission to fuck Shiro. Granted it wasn't an actual sex scene, but the entire build up was obviously that of them having sex.

    Anyway they are finally on their way to fight Gil and destroy the grail. This was a pretty poor build up episode that did no properly set the mood for the final showdown mostly because of Rin's tsundere act being played for comedy.

    I know I shouldn't be this pissed off by the episode, but goddamn does it push all my buttons. For me this was the worst episode of the series. A boring plodding episode that has a ton of talking but doesn't explain some important concepts. Instead we get worthless conversations with Saber and a weird out of place "memory" from Rin. I mean really? That's her most embarrassing memory? Also Shiro is a fucking idiot.

    Man,I don't know how I am going to get through another hour of this series. We've got one normal episode and then another double length episode. I pretty much despise everything about this episode.
  12. Taek

    Taek Well-Known Member

    Posted by Taek on Jun 7, 2015
    Episode 22

    I am beyond words for this show.

  13. ZetsubouKaiji

    ZetsubouKaiji Forum Moderator Database Moderator

    Was it the magic neon fish? I'll just assume it was the magic neon fish.

    Edit: I'm reading those were supposed to be dolphins. Apparently no one at Ufotable has ever seen a dolphin.
  14. Taek

    Taek Well-Known Member

    Posted by Taek on Jun 7, 2015
    They looked like sperm to me. But holy shit what kind of dolphins do they have in Japan?
  15. ZetsubouKaiji

    ZetsubouKaiji Forum Moderator Database Moderator

    Well dolphins are violent sex offenders so maybe it was neon dolphin sperm.


    Watching this gif for twenty minutes would be more satisfying than that episode.
  16. Taek

    Taek Well-Known Member

    Posted by Taek on Jun 7, 2015
    I just realized that almost the entire episode was built around trying to make us think that Rin and Shirou
    were going to fuck.

    Even angrier about it now than I was before.
  17. ZetsubouKaiji

    ZetsubouKaiji Forum Moderator Database Moderator

    Now you understand how I feel about this episode. It also makes Saber a terrible third wheel in the episode.

    The episode was probably also the cheapest looking one yet. There was very little animation and even a lot of long shots to avoid animating lip flap. Even the studio didn't give enough of a shit to animate the thing. Unlimited Budgetworks my ass.
  18. Taek

    Taek Well-Known Member

    Posted by Taek on Jun 7, 2015
    Yeah the animation in general has been a huge step down this season, and the fight choreography has totally shit itself. The fight between
    Gil and Shirou is going to be awful, 2 people just spamming swords at each other with loads of idiotic philosophy thrown at each other.

    The other thing is just how seriously and self congratulatory the episode took itself this week, considering what you wrote about the episode and my earlier comment, it really has no basis to think that they've done anything right at all.
  19. LinkSword




    As awful as that episode was, the last scene kind of makes it worth it. A+, would see getting Akira-fied again.
  20. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Posted by Guest on Jun 9, 2015
    Episode 21;

    Where it go wrong?


    What an awful episode. I thought that the mana transfer scene was kind of cool until the Dolphin-Thing showed up. TBH, it would've been more interesting if Rin and Shirou had actually ****ed.

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