Fate/stay night: Unlimited Blade Works TV 2

Discussion in 'Specific Anime Discussion' started by Naga, Apr 1, 2015.

  1. ieatanime

    ieatanime Active Member

    the ship was moving around he himself didn't and either way, my point stands, he was never touched in f/z and was never touched here. also notice that in f/z he never really have an intent to kill, he is just having fun toying with the others while here (in illya's case in particular) he is going all out.


    and i agree that that the writing is bad in some departments, especially the "romance" part and the characters' interactions concerning it but i fail to see the plotholes that you guys keep complaining about each episode, i mean seriously tae is complaining because the chain is called chains of heaven instead of enkidu, just what kind of complain is this if its not nitpicking.
     
  2. Taek

    Taek Well-Known Member

    Posted by Taek on Apr 19, 2015
    #42
    Because in the VN it's called Enkidu, and Enkidu is a significant part of who Gil is and was.

    Gil was on the flying craft he was using to fight berserker watch the fight again. Berserker catches his weapons and uses them against him, Gil does not have an easy time.

    Here's the dogfight
     
  3. ieatanime

    ieatanime Active Member

    its full name is Enkidu:chains of heaven so calling it one or the other doesnt make a difference and doesnt affect the plot for better or worse so i fail to see the problem there.

    as for the fight, i remember it by heart and as i said he was never touched there or here so again i fail to see the issue not to mention you keep ignoring the fact that berserker here was held back by protecting his master while berserker in f/z didn't.
     
  4. Taek

    Taek Well-Known Member

    Posted by Taek on Apr 19, 2015
    #44
    It's not just about being touched, it's about not just sitting there spamming the same attack again and again while being put under no pressure himself. If you bothered to watch those videos, you'd see that he comes under attack and is forced to take action, Berserker get's him angry. Having the chains called Enkidu is still relevant to his character.

    The fact that Berserker here was protecting Illya is neither hear nor there, you can still fight defensively and win, here though he is just embarrassingly curbstomped, he puts Gil under no pressure at all apart from one point at the very end, by which point he has already failed. It's terrible writing meant only to make Gil look even more OP than he already is.

    It's exactly the same tactic they used in the first season where Saber gets OSKO'd by Casters human master, only to show just how strong Shirou is with his asspull teenage angst powers.
     
  5. PockyCandy

    PockyCandy New Member

    OK, I'm watching the episode, and am prepared to be disappointed.
     
  6. lanif1

    lanif1 Member

    I'm on the fence about the whole Berserker VS Gilgamesh battle this episode, it's by no means bad or anything remotely close, but it could be better. After watching Space Adventure Cobra, Lupin the 3rd: the secret of Mamo and Highlander the search for vengeance all in the past month, I suspect my standards are somewhat gimped, because those movies were horrible, but still, I stand by what I just mentioned.

    On the one hand I think the battle could have been executed better, there's only so much the writers can do without changing the source material and the writers aren't Gen Urobuchi this time around, but the writers could have at least shortened the flashback somewhat and gave us a battle with some more tension. Like when I was playing through the visual novel for example, I at least had the feeling that Berserker was gradually moving towards Gilgamesh and if he had gotten close enough then Gilgamesh might actually lose his head or something, it was exciting to wonder who would give out first, Berserkers lives or Gilgamesh and his distance. I didn't really feel that this time, perhaps it's due to the flashback and battle length ratio, perhaps it's due to the soundtrack, or perhaps it's due to the fact I already knew what was going to happen, but whatever the case, that's just one example of how I think the battle could have been executed a little better.

    Though at the same time the battle was a lolstomp in the visual novel and while the execution could have been better, the result should rightfully have also been a lolstomp here too. Gilgamesh is badass and Berserker never had much of a chance while protecting his princess. The dude can spam A++ rank noble phantasms. Even Rider with all his awesomeness in Fate/Zero couldn't make Gilgamesh budge an inch, lose any composure, or even break a sweat, so it's not like this kind of battle hasn't occurred before. Gilgamesh literally stood in the same spot during that entire battle with King of Conquerors, Gilgamesh is a badass that can win battles in such a fashion, so don't be surprised if it happens here too.

    Also I don't know if anyone cares, and it's probably only of semi-relevance, but here is the poll on mal for this episode:

    5 out of 5: Loved it! ............408......77.27%
    4 out of 5: Liked it................55........10.42%
    3 out of 5: It was OK...........35.........6.63%
    2 out of 5: Disliked it...........2...........2.27%
    1 out of 5: Hated it..............18.........3.41%
    Voters: 528

    Take that however you will.
     
  7. PockyCandy

    PockyCandy New Member

    I haven't played the VN, so everything is a surprise to me. Just gonna throw that out there before I start. Yeah, I agree that the battle could've been better, probably by cutting down on the length of the flashback by about 5 minutes. Although.......I liked this flashback a lot more than last weeks' flashback. Like the guy/gal I'm quoting, the battle was in fact, a LOLstomp (I'm gonna have to remember that term).
    I was not expecting the ending though. I figured that Rin would distract Gil long enough to allow an escape. I was wrong. I'm still wondering if Illya is alive or not.

    I still like Gil, unlike a lot of other people posting. He still seems like the same guy, and who knows; maybe he'll reveal some hidden-depths over these last few episodes. And thanks for reminding me of the Gil Vs Rider battle from F/Z, that episode was amazing.
    It does seem like the people on this forum are much, much, MUCH more critical/negative than mal or other sites in general. That can be a good and a bad thing.
     
  8. LinkSword

    LinkSword POPEE BELIEVER

    Generally I don't feel like posting in this thread because I'm just finding the show dull and not worth criticizing, but I need to point out that hearing all these flashbacks -like this week's, or the one with Caster- are anime original is pretty hilarious to me. Normally you'd think something as relatively important as a character's backstory would be content dating back to the original material, not new scenes to further establish them. Especially Ilya, because that flashback regardless of its quality really defines how she came to be the way she is today after the events in F/Z, and her stance on what she thinks happened with Kiritsugu, who was a pivotal person for her since she was born.

    My point is, the more I learn about things such as these the more I feel like the VN was a very incomplete work.
     
  9. Moonfail

    Moonfail Member

    I'll have to agree with you on here; this scene was barely emphasized in the VN, and Ilya's existence is only really fully explained by the events in Fate/Zero. I'm actually quite happy with the adaptation, as ufotable fully intended for this to be watched after F/Z; animation is pretty amazing as well.

    Unfortunate to hear that the show seems dull and boring to you, probably my favorite route in the VN :(
     
  10. ZetsubouKaiji

    ZetsubouKaiji Forum Moderator Database Moderator

    I feel like the animation is wasted on such dull fights though. The last really good fight in this series was Saber vs Berserker and Rin vs Illya way back in the first season. Both those battles were well done with some sense of excitement and danger to them.
     
  11. Moonfail

    Moonfail Member

    Haha, yeah, maybe so. Either way, perhaps the main reason I'm watching this is for (VN spoilers!)

    Shirou v. Archer. They better do justice to that fight, still my favorite scene in all of VNs, with the incessant clashing of blades.

    There's also Shirou v. Gilgamesh, which I imagine will also be amazing.
     
  12. ZetsubouKaiji

    ZetsubouKaiji Forum Moderator Database Moderator

    Episode 16:

    This keep getting worse.
    This week had one unintentionally hilarious moment when Lancer looked like he was flirting with Shiro, but then it was all leading up to Shiro's facepalm outburst about Lancer keeping his hands off Rin. The outburst came completely out of left field and isn't even in character with Shiro, but this is what passes for romance in Unlimited Bladeworks. They've had a few indirect flirting scenes and now Shiro is all but confessing. Link used the word incomplete last week when talking about how much new material the anime has to add to the LN to get everything to stick together and incomplete is the way the relationship with Rin feels at the moment. There is a feeling that there are several scenes missing to connect what we've seen so far to Shiro's sudden outburst.

    Beyond the episode is a lot of set up. Instead of getting his idiot master in the clear then turning around to kill Shiro and RIn, Gilgs just gets bored. Rin and shiro have another poorly written conversation about his stupid personality before they decide to align with Lancer. I don't see much upside for Lancer or his master to side with these two and it's going to be some major bullshit asspull that Rin is going to be able to be beat caster. I assume she's going to try and play on the whole betrayed by men angle to blindside caster and it will probably be very stupid but that's the most plausible angle.

    Then we get to see Caster's master and he has a whole scene with Archer to confirm that Nasu forgot to give him a personality and he is in fact boring as shit. I just find it hilarious that he outright says he has no way to explain his actions and doesn't have any defining characteristics. Sure thing dude!

    Now a big fight happens and I couldn't feel any more apathetic.
     
  13. Taek

    Taek Well-Known Member

    Posted by Taek on Apr 25, 2015
    #53
    Shirou just wants Lancer's Gay Bulge.
     
  14. ZetsubouKaiji

    ZetsubouKaiji Forum Moderator Database Moderator

    [​IMG]

    Funniest comment I've read on the forum in quite some time. :laugh:
     
  15. lanif1

    lanif1 Member

    Looks like some shiz is about to go down over at the church.
     
  16. Taek

    Taek Well-Known Member

    Posted by Taek on Apr 26, 2015
    #56
    Episode 16

    Feeling pretty damn meh about this one. The tonal shift between Shirou looking like he's suffering from PTSD after burying Illya to the 'comedy' with Lancer teasing Rin was as jarring as nails on a chalk board, or rubbing broken glass into my gums. The conversation between Rin and Shirou was shit too, and only sought to show us how awesome Shirou is in his own fucked up way.

    Lancer could have been a good foil to cut through all this shit, instead he just kinds of goes along with it. In a weird way i find him the most interesting character at the minute, but I'm 100% certain that it's purely because we haven't seen enough of him to be totally ruined by the awful writing and direction. Speaking of direction, what ZK pointed out in DAT is a great example of that, I know others have said that it's supposed to be poking fun at Shirou because of his "HURR DURR WIMMIN CAN'T FIGHT" mentality, but it just comes across as confusing because Shirou looks oblivious to it.

    Archer and Casters masters conversation seemed pointless, it pretty much amounted to "I'm not a real human boy" or something. How Rin and Shirou think they'll beat Caster is beyond me, no matter how it plays out it'll be a huge asspull if they don't get turned into human goop.

    At least Gil ripping out Illya's heart (fucking really Nasu?) wasn't as grimdark as it could have been. Gil sparing them both was weird though, not like it wouldn't have taken him all of 15 seconds to skewer them a thousand times. I hope Shinji dies horribly.
     
  17. ZetsubouKaiji

    ZetsubouKaiji Forum Moderator Database Moderator

    Yeah, the reason Lancer might be the most tolerable character is also the reason that scene fails so badly and conveys the wrong message. We don't know anything about Lancer. He's barely been around since the start of the first season and that was mostly for action. The good of that is there's still some air of mystery around the character instead of him being shrouded in the show's BS writing, but the bad is there's no reason to assume his intention is trying to get a reaction out of Shiro because why the hell would he do that? It doesn't do anything to move forward his plan for the upcoming fight and it's a strange thing to do to someone that is all but a stranger.

    Which brings up another point character's aren't very expressive during dialogues. A lot of the exposition in this sticks out because characters talk in the same monotone whenever delivering exposition or listening to it. Shiro is the worst because his expression is almost always the same wooden frown. In the last few episodes we've had speeches from Lancer, Gilgs and Archer and they all speak with the same even bland tone as if they're reading the phone book.
     
  18. Taek

    Taek Well-Known Member

    Posted by Taek on Apr 26, 2015
    #58
    Yeah the characters expressions was something I brought up at the end of last season too, Rin is seemingly the only character capable of having a different expression on her face, and in her voice, which just highlights the monotony of everyone else. Lancer could be an interesting character with a little work, his myth is pretty great if not all that well known, he has supposedly one of the most powerful noble phantasms, and he's pretty self aware. However, I only really see him as a vessel for more action, and to make Archer look better.
     
  19. ZetsubouKaiji

    ZetsubouKaiji Forum Moderator Database Moderator

    The sad thing is the only way to know any of that stuff about Lancer is to have seen Zero. Lancer was a great character in Zero, but this version of the character always seems a bit off. The way this Lancer carries himself and speaks is similar but different enough that even though they're based on the same noble spirit I think of them as different characters which is why I don't really count what I know from Zero as a part of this series.

    It's a less exaggerated version of the difference between the incarnations of Gil. In that case the difference is worse because they're not just based on the same spirit but they're literally the same summon.

    The expressions thing really bugs me because the amount of money that's gone into the art and animation. It's another thing that makes me think Ufotable is half assing this thing.
     
  20. PockyCandy

    PockyCandy New Member

    Episode 16: I'll keep this short:

    This episode was SSSSSSSOOOOOOOOOOO BORING!!! Like the other person said, all of the characters (sans Rin) talk in monotone voices. And really, none of the characters (sans Rin again) have much personality. I really don't give a F*** about what happens to Shirou, Lancer, Archer, etc. Really, this episode was just one big exposition scene with some forced romance.

    Really, I just want to see Saber be awesome. Can they please grant this small request?
     

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